Before you had Bidean's book, now of Superpowers. Would you say it's a series of books? Or are they very different?
A little bit of the two. In fact, I was going to make a recipe book, but it's been time, unintentionally, that has changed its mind and has become a sequential tone. And now I think it should be, as a complement to Bidean. A friend professor [one of those who has already read the book] has told me that they feed each other, and I agree. Finally, what Bidean proposes is to initiate a process of reflection, to promote the debate about some principles; and the second book, Superpowers, wants to address the issue from a practice. The latter has more irony and humor, and we go more to practice. But it doesn't mean it's an instruction book, let alone. However, it can give clues.

Along the way, you asked the professor to take the lead. What do you ask for in this second?
To share leadership, because there is not a single leader. There are pedagogical leaders, administrative leaders, leaders in humor, in sensitivity... The project will come from everyone’s input. And then I would ask that a school project be launched and that I be approached with enthusiasm, that it be held with me. And to spread it, because illusion is contagious. Let this illusion spread in schools, in the cloisters and in the educational communities.

In recent years he has given many lectures and seminars on the occasion of the book Walking. There would certainly be some concerns among the participants. They'll ask you how to do what you think.
That was the first reason that led me to write the book. But I am not coming to give a concrete and definitive answer. We, here at Larraul's school, have looked for a way to respond to that, but that doesn't mean that ours is useful in other schools. After all, every child is the method, and what is worth to one child is not worth to the other. I think there are some ways of working at the bottom, and I've tried to answer the question generally in the book. But what has been said: the formula cannot be repeated. Everyone has to look for theirs. I think it's every teacher's job to want to answer the question of how.

There was a second reason to write the book, and maybe that's also why I wanted to laugh. The schools that we're transforming like this, the ones that we've taken deep or almost dramatic steps and the ones that we've changed, sometimes we feel judged. I myself have felt this way many times, as if I had to always justify myself. “It’s easy,” “it’s just worth in very small schools,” “and then what?”, “Are you going to give the level?”… It costs me a lot.

Feeling of contempt?
Yes ... And with this [notes the book] I want to say no. It is an accepted and proven, well-focused, valid, proven issue that we have been like this for a few years now. This book is a way of claiming “it’s possible!”

You say there are no magic recipes, because every child and every school needs their own methodology. But let's give you a few strokes. Where do we start building?
I speak in the book to start the house on the roof. Even if it may be very pompous, I think it's like this: dreaming, thinking about what class you want to build, how you would like to work... Because then reality is going to prune the project and it's going to bring you down to earth, reality is going to make the earthly project. But it starts to be built from the roof, with optimism and smile.

Name, first job.
That's the first step, yes. Because that's how it happened to us, eh. At Larraul's school, change was not a decision, but a process that developed naturally. But the key was to name the project, even though there was nothing written at the time, not even built. Naming him was delusional and we were eager.

What you wrote was a school project, more than an educational project. The book clearly distinguishes both concepts. In some cases they
may be the same, but I differentiate them and I do not think that one is more important than the other. The educational project will probably be the most important document in a school. But to differentiate it, I would say that the educational project is the present, the document that gathers what we are doing here and now, and the school project can be something for the future, a project, an illusion or a direction. I understand as a school project what is for the entire school, from nursery school to older students.

The curriculum is a wall that is often referred to. Due to its limitations, it is often a source of concern and complaint for teachers and the educational community. In the book, you don't go deep into it, but you mention it. An
illustrative example: here in our valley, there are so many schools and schools, and I'm convinced that we all have the curriculum as a base, and we'll all say we work with the curriculum. And instead, you'll be able to find very different classes. Nothing to say when leaving this valley. So, one of the two: either we're fooling some, or the resume is flexible and can be interpreted. I bet on that second. I don't think anyone lies, but you can understand it in different ways, and each one gives it its meaning, its wealth. I don't want to defend the curriculum, but I do think it's flexible. Moreover, in its general provisions it says that each school has full autonomy to enrich its curriculum; we do so, we understand it.

Another wall more or less that has caused many dislikes: Education Act of Álava, Bizkaia and Gipuzkoa.
I'm more of those who look inside. There are many external factors that also influence. I think this process of the Education Act has also been a pessimism for teachers, because it was thought that from a broad consensus something richer would emerge. And what we thought was not done, but I believe that much has been learned in the process, and that positive conclusions will also be drawn, because there have been many debates and many contributions have been gathered.

Look, the Education Act is not a claim, it's a need. In Euskal Herria, we need our own educational framework, which is not administratively fragmented. If children are told that they have to cooperate, that they have to interact and interact, it is inevitable that adults will be an example of that. The Education Act has not flourished on this occasion, but the most suitable model for children must continue to be sought.

One recommendation: read the monograph published by Hik Hasi, the coordinates for the next day.

Along the way, the school project that Larraul had named the book. Now the Superpowers. You seem to have given more focus to the child. It highlights that adults carry a child inside and that children do not have adults... Luckily!
If children took an adult inside, they would come down to reality. What children do is that we have said before that we dream of a project. Then, as we get into maturity, we get down to reality and we dream less, we build less, we're much more disruptive. That's where the idea goes. I've tried to identify some of the superpowers that we had when we were children, to use them as clues in our schools. There may also be more superpowers, tens, eleven.

One of the entries [has three] gives rise to the decision to highlight the superpowers in the book. There's a message from a friend among them. They have seen “deficiencies” in school to their child and that it is very good.
As if the latter balanced it... When I finished writing the entry text, I took my friend's message and flipped the script completely. So far, I had thought about writing the recipe book and writing the approach. Well, instead of erasing the text that I did, I decided to leave it there so that the mistake would be discovered, so that you could see what my inertia was. The second entry didn't go well either. The third one, yes, I was happy. I clearly saw that you really have to deactivate the inertia and make the students' superpowers look.

Deficiencies, like we adults don't have them.
It's a matter of looking. Depending on how you look, deficiencies can also be seen as a superpower. We have a stereotyped student marked, and then, on the way to that, we uncover the deficiencies. And you have to look at the shortcomings, because we all have them. What is more, it is interesting that we are aware of the shortcomings we have. But also be the master of those superpowers that the students have and that each has. That is why I demand a change in schools; that is, every student must create their own schools to develop their superpower. Change of look: focus on what you do more than what you lack, or look at it more.

In many of the workshops or spaces we have in our school my deficiencies emerge; in others, I identify my strengths. And the kids too. I already mentioned it in the previous book: they are children, they are not stupid. But that's good, and when you identify what your shortcomings are and what your strengths are, you judge your partner less.