You’re a victim of ETA and more than the daughter of Ernest Lluch… From the polyhedral vision advocated by Ane
Muguruza, who knows me for being the daughter of my father, he’s looking at my life from a single angle. It's obvious that I'm my father's daughter, because I have a terrible resemblance, especially, but I'm also more than that. Our personality and mentality is made up of various variables, one of which is being a victim of ETA, but I would say that it is better to define myself, for example, as a historian.

On June 13, the voices of several victims from Euskal Herria and Catalonia were heard in the Building of Peace conference. How did you experience it? The experience was
very enriching and useful and, above all, the contribution of Ane Muguruza. In Catalonia, or at least in my environment, we have had few opportunities to hear experiences like yours. It was amazing. The pain we felt at one time was probably the same, but so far we have not had the opportunity to get to know each other.

Has the pain of the victims been kept secret for all these years?
The experience of the victims of ETA seems to have been heard more, because a few associations that dialogue on behalf of all have made noise. In any case, rather than silence the suffering of the victims, I would say that there has been a lack of communication: we have not listened to the pain of the victims of the State and, at the same time, I believe that some Basques have not paid attention to the testimony of the victims of ETA either. That is why the days of Barcelona were very important, because we found a place for understanding. It is clear that the feeling of loneliness, disillusionment and helplessness has been the same among all victims.

Spokesman for the Permanent Social Forum, Agus Hernan, pointed out that the initiative should serve for reconciliation between Basque society and Catalonia. Do you share?
I do not need to reconcile myself with Basque society, because Euskal Herria is not responsible for my pain. I have simply been offended by some Euskaldunes. It is true that at some stage a part of society was silent in the face of terrorism, but that does not hold all Basques accountable, it was just lacking!

You say that this is an exception for the victims of ETA. Why?
Because I've always felt overwhelmed. His father’s murder marked a turning point in Catalonia, as did the Hipercor attack. With the name of Ernest Lluch, libraries, hospitals, schools and streets are here and there. I have never felt alone and, therefore, I am an exception. The names of the majority of ETA victims are not known to people, I am sure that if you now go out into the street and ask for the names of ten ETA victims, people would not name them.

Have you ever felt represented with victim associations?
Never. Neither with the Spanish AVT nor with the Catalan ACVOs, moreover, their reasoning tends to be totally opposed to mine. But the most worrying thing, in my view, is that they have assumed the freedom to express their opinion on behalf of all, without any sense. The associations of victims do not have to pronounce on abortion, nor on the independence of Catalonia, for example.

There are also those who believe that they have been used by the victim in defence of the interests of the parties. Do you agree?
All parties, without exception, have resorted to the pain of victims with interests on the part of them. Well, we're human. Beyond the banalisation of terrorism, however, an in-depth project for the management of the damage caused would be indispensable.

In favour of coexistence, several ETA victims have met prisoners who are in prisons. What do you think?
Of course, all the strategies that have been used to overcome what has happened are valid. And I would say that we are no one to judge the ways the victims use to ease their pain. I find it incredible that Gorka Landaburu or Robert Manrique know those responsible for their attacks, and I also find it incredible that Ane Muguruza does not have to. They're personal strategies, but certainly they're all useful for building a peaceful future.

Would you?
I don't know, if I had a chance to do that, I would think so. But I'm clear that that doesn't alleviate my pain. More recently, I knew where the members of the command that killed my father were, and that information has not directly affected me. Hate and rage don't let you think. My biggest concern is that, as was the case with Franco, the ETA conflict is falsely closed and its consequences are paid within 20 or 30 years.

ETA is over. How did he receive the news?
I somehow regained the feeling I had seven years ago after the Declaration of Aiete. But for me, the most important news was that of 2011. That is why I am sure now I have not felt that positive shock that I then experienced, because I was convinced of the end of ETA. I was more surprised, and for the better, by the content of the ETA statement on the damage caused.

Many of the victims reported a lack of transparency.
Yes, but I do not agree, because ETA has gone further than I thought. It is true that the expression has a serious problem: it leaves room for misunderstanding. And so it would have been possible to avoid it if it had been clearer, but maybe that was the goal. In any case, it is positive.

What are the main challenges from now on? It will
be difficult but we have to reach a point of view that satisfies everyone. There is a desire, but there are still reasons that make us all angry. Well, I'm a historian, and I think time will be the key. Just as ETA has taken many years to take important steps, now you have to understand that, on the other hand, it will also take years to take steps. Rhythms cannot be accelerated and ETA completed, it will take at least one or two generations to rebuild bridges.

Gorka Landaburu says that the thick bar in prison has the same strength in both Seville and Vitoria. What do you think of dispersion? Firstly,
the suffering of dispersion in many families who are not responsible for their status as victims of terrorism is absolutely unnecessary. On the other hand, laws will more or less like us, but they must be complied with. It is clear that, as the lawyers who participated in the conference reiterated, the dispersion is being used in Spain as a form of revenge. Therefore, since the rules of the game cannot be changed in the middle of the game, it is imperative that the prisoners are close to home.

Catalonia is also hot and the Spanish Justice has accused the CoR of a terrorist offence for the same reason. What do you think? The
CoR of Catalonia is insulting the memory of the victims of terrorism compared to terrorism. If you go abroad and are accused of terrorism by cutting the toll highway, you won't believe it. It's stupid.

How do you experience the political context in Catalonia?
Very bad. For starters, it's too complex, and I'd like not to go into this too much, but I'm worried. Not allowing the referendum to take place seems to me to be a tremendous mistake, just as the application of Article 155 is a mistake. But I also think it is wrong to impose a unilateral path without 50% of the votes. We are accumulating too many problems.

What do you think of the CSP that supported 155?All
Catalan political parties have paused to the full in recent months. Self-criticism is essential for understanding and, unfortunately, the political parties have so far seen the other party as responsible for the problem.

Mariano Rajoy has been expelled and Pedro Sánchez is now president. Do you have hope?
I want to have hope. Only understanding is lacking.

Before it was concluded, last August Catalonia suffered the bloodiest attack of the last three decades.
Yes, and there are still unlocalized victims. Preceded by Robert Manrique, the victim of the Hipercor attack, a group of citizens has had to organise a platform to respond to these needs. The irresponsibility of public institutions is tremendous and, in this case, the responsibility is not only of the Spanish Government, but also of the Generalitat.

To what extent has it influenced this Catalan political context?
It is a matter of priorities. The Generalitat should have a victim care office in place since September, so there is no excuse for not responding to what happened in Barcelona and Cambrils. But given that Artur Mas took over the presidency and closed the information and advice service to the victims of terrorism, I expect anything.