Automatically translated from Basque, translation may contain errors. More information here. Elhuyarren itzultzaile automatikoaren logoa

"The Government of Patxi Lopez has the mortgage in the creation document"

  • It's Elorrio, 1966. He has a degree in audiovisual communication and German philology. Member of Parliament of Aralar. In his words, the budgets have come out of the pact between the PSE and the PNV “whether the president is López, or Ibarretxe,” he insists.
Mikel Basabe
"Ez litzateke ahaztu behar aurrekontuak Alderdi Sozialistaren eta EAJren arteko hitzarmenetik atera direla, lehendakaria Lopez izan, Ibarretxe izan".Alex Larretxi
In April, Mikel Basabe spent a year as a member of parliament: “I spent two years in the previous legislature as an advisor to Mr. Ezenarro. So I knew about the parliamentary chambers. The practice of non-legal procedures, proposals and requests. I also had a relationship with the rest of the team.” We started with experience. We asked you to start with a statement of this: “There’s a lot of work going on here,” he said.

Otherwise, has Parliament's activity surprised you in any way?


Don't be surprised. But I would say that something is wrong with this replacement system. The person who is a Member of Parliament – a Member of Parliament or a Senator – owes his or her place to the party rather than to the electorate, which leads to a strong dependence on the party.

Isn't that the case with Aralar?


The advantage that we – because we are four – have is that, when we have any doubts about a proposal, we have the opportunity to change our position. Firstly, because we have only one representative on the committees. At the moment we have the flexibility to determine the attitude according to what we have heard. One of the concerns here - and it is not just the concern of this Parliament - is that party discipline obliges the Member of Parliament to take a detailed vote before the matter is discussed. If that's surprising, to say the least.


López’s government has turned a year old. What is your assessment of the activity?


The mortgage of this government is in the document of creation and time has left this even more important. This government was born out of an agreement between the Socialist Party and the People’s Party, which has several points defined. The PP marks the government’s performance, which is directly reflected, for example, in all the controversies that are taking place in education.

Its members consider it a government of change and normalization, including that of transversality.


When they say normalization, they are referring to the incorporation of this country within the norm, they want to normalize the Basque Autonomous Community (CAV) as another community within Spain. But this government is only possible in the Basque Country, nowhere else. The PSOE and the PP understand each other and give each other government in the Basque Country and Navarre. The transversality of Patxi López is not one of the values that they have proclaimed, precisely because the government – with a minority of popular votes – faces the majority of the population, and it faces it precisely overcoming all aspects of its ideology, except in the case of the Spanish idea. This government has no purpose or purpose for transversity.

He was the head of the Basque Government for 30 years. Can't you say the change wasn't for the better? Not even from a left-wing perspective?


It is true that for the last 30 years the PNV has been at the head of the government, but on the other hand, it should not be forgotten that the budgets have come out of the agreement between the Socialist Party and the PNV, whether the president is López or Ibarretxe, they have signed those agreements. The same is true of laws with social content. Socialists and socialists have always had an agreement. So, has anything changed from a left point of view? The PSE-EE would need another partner to change from the left. Can anyone really think that a government in need of the PP can change from the left? The PSE is the one who for years has agreed on budgets, social laws, even fiscal policy with the PNV. This year too. Therefore, in order to be a leftist, the PSE should first have the will to influence the leftist approaches.


Let's take a look at some of the departments: The policy of Rodolfo Ares, who directs the Department of the Interior, for example.


This government continues to revolve around symbols. This includes, for example, photographs of prisoners and their harassment of symbols on the streets of the Basque Country. However, it has been accepted in this Parliament that information about Etxerat's performance should be provided to the courts. It is absolutely necessary to consider the suffering of all victims in this country, to resort to reparation for all types of victims and to put in place the means to prevent them from being victimized again. There is no hierarchy among the victims and if it is done – if we do not develop empathy for the suffering that is most distant – we will not take a step forward in this field that is absolutely necessary for this country.

About the Peace Education Plan. What's your opinion?


The plan has been complemented by a political approach, without taking into account the educational community. First the plan has been drawn up and then it has been transmitted to the educational community. The plan belongs to the PSE and PP, according to Basagoi, “yes or yes” to this plan.


The school board has somehow approved the plan.


We will not criticize the autonomy of the School Board. The plan passed to them and in the evaluation they said, among other things, that the plan has political content and objectives.


What do you think of the replacement of the President-in-Office of the Council, Mr Konrado Mugertz?


What has happened suggests that these types of charges are subject to political use. They haven't given a good picture.


Could the plan be approved by EAJ?


That's what the jealous will have to say. Our attitude is there. We waited until we had him in our hands to give us an opinion on the plan, as well as to forward our allegations to the Department of Education. In this matter it is advisable to proceed with great caution. After we made the allegations, we made our opinion known to the public.

How do you see the educational community again, in front of the plan.


There is a need for a broader approach to the situation of the educational community. That is why the trade union majority, the ELA, LAB and EILAS unions, have called for a strike in public education on May 25. That's for something. Such a decision is not simply made. Indeed, the Government ' s tendency is to make decisions and then to give education to the community. In our opinion, it has not been possible to develop cooperation with all the actors in the field of education.

Aralar supports the call for strikes.


We respect what the unions do. There are reasons to mobilize.

The strike is disproportionate.


Joseba Egibar said that this is not the time for a strike. When was the time for a strike? The GV has not changed.

We will move on to another area: the peace process, the normalization process or the democratic process. How would you name the process?


process that needs to be done.

To get what?


Among other things, to offer this country the nationalist leftist approach it needs and deserves. To get it. But this requires overcoming the types of struggles that are overcome, as well as providing fixed bases for collaboration.

How do you see unity in this task?


I'm an optimist myself. The Stand Up Basque Country declaration paves the way for hope. Now, respect between the parties on the road and in the task must prevail in order to establish a solid basis for collaboration. From there everything is possible.

Is there such respect between the Union and Aralar? What is the correct political approach to left-wing nationalism?


Our political approach to begin with is not Copyright, our approach is Copyleft. The political views of the left are not those of anyone, they are those of everyone who wants to practice. Since 2006, we have had an official meeting with the Union for the first time two weeks ago.


What can the relationship bring?


To meet normally from our side, what we have always asked for, what is happening now. Solid foundations should now be laid. In fact, so far, it has been the case that political decisions have been taken – that is where the documents are – but that when the [ETA] attacks have occurred, these political decisions have not been developed. When we say that we have to lay solid foundations, that is what we are talking about. That in the future, whatever happens, political decisions must continue.

How do you assess the Brussels Declaration in this regard?


The Brussels Declaration is right when it calls for a verifiable definitive ceasefire from ETA. And he guesses that this is the step that we Left patriots absolutely need, all of us. This would be a huge step forward, but it cannot be linked to the fact that the Spanish Government does this or that. Whatever the Spanish government does, left-wing nationalists must continue to lay the groundwork for collaboration, and the only contribution ETA can make to this is the definitive cessation of the armed struggle.

Brian Currin says that it is necessary to demand steps from ETA, but also from the Spanish government. You don't seem to join in on that.


But whose good is it that ETA abandons the armed struggle? I've got it clean. Especially for the good of the Basque population, especially for the patriots and not to mention the independentist citizens. It is in our own interest to continue the struggle that we will have to continue before the Spanish State by other means. That is to say, we cannot condition these roads according to what the Spanish State does. For us, the scenario where there is no armed struggle is much better, for us, the independent Basques of the left.

Will the lines of the Patriotic Left converge?


Since the creation of Aralar, we have said that we will not wait for anyone. We will meet along the way when there are grounds to meet, with the one who has the will to meet. We are making our way, this decision is irreversible.
"EAEn zergatik ez da NaBai gertatu? Oinarri sendorik ez daukagulako. Ez momentuz"
Eusko Legebiltzarrerako hurrengo hauteskundeetan hautagaitza bateratua egin dezakete, demagun, EA, Batasuna eta Aralarrek.

 

Erabaki atzeraezintasuna aipatu dut lehenago hain justu. Izan ere, ez dago jakiterik hasten diren bideak noraino iristen diren. Beraz, uneon nekez esan dezaket ezer.

Alderdi Politikoen Legea tarteko, demagun EA eta Batasuna batzen direla.


Hori ere ez dago jakiterik. Nik hau baino ezin dut esan: une honetan Eusko Legebiltzarrean herritarren boto gutxiago dute Gobernua sostengatzen duten alderdiek, Gobernuaren kontra ari direnek baino. Horri kanpoan geratu ziren 100.000 mila botoak gehituz gero, nabarmena da une honetako egoerak nori egiten dion mesede eta nori kalte.

Polo eta gune subiranista hizpide. Batzuek polo eta gune bereizten dute, EAko Pello Urizarrek kasu. Aralarrek ez ditu polo ez gune gustuko antza, edo behintzat ez da EAren eta ezker abertzale ofizialaren arrastoan sartu orainokoan. Zergatik?

Duela hamar egun elkartu ginen Batasunarekin, azken lau urteetan lehen aldiz. Hori horrela bada, zer elkar lan mota egin daiteke orain arte Aralarrekin elkartzeko asmoa izan ez duenarekin? Hori iraganari begira. Etorkizunari begira: egongo al dira oinarri sendoak? Egongo al da errespeturik? Egongo da epe luzerako begirada? Eta hauxe gehituko dut: hemen ez dago inor sobran. Hemen sobran borroka molde zehatz batzuk dira.

EArekin Nafarroan bai, baina EAEn ez. Non dago koska?

Lehenik, erantzun luzea behar du galderak, abertzaletasunaren ibilbide historikoari begiratu behar baitzaio. Hamarkadetan abertzaletasunaren gidaritza EAEtik egin da. Uste zen EAErentzat erabakitzen zena egokia zela ere Nafarroarentzat, areago, Ipar Euskal Herriarentzat ere bai. Euskal abertzaletasunaren jarduna horixe izan da, eta hori autokritika ere bada, ni horretan aritu bainaiz.

NaBai sortzen denean, UPNren eta PSNren jarreraren aurka sortzen bada ere –ez da hori arrazoi bakarra, ez baita bakarrik sortzen bertako Gobernuak Nafarroan euskara eta euskal zaletasunaren aurkako jardunari kontra egiteko–, euskal abertzaletasunak Nafarroarako planteamenduekin lan egin behar duelako sortzen da, Nafarroako ikuspegiekin bertako beharrei erantzuteko. Hori oso garrantzitsua da NaBai zertarako sortzen den ulertzeko.

NaBai gutxieneko batzuk adostuta sortzen da. Besteak beste, ETAren jardunaren kontrako planteamenduarekin.
Ez da bakarrik Nafarroan hauteskundeen aurreko abertzaleon elkarlana posible, Ipar Euskal Herrian ere bada. Bertan AB, EA eta Batasunak EHBai plataforma sortu zuten. Zer dute biek komunean? Oinarri sendoak dituztela eta abertzaletasuna beren esparrutik beren esparruko beharrei erantzun gura izatea.

EAEn zergatik ez da hori gertatu? Oinarri sendorik ez daukagulako. Ez momentuz. Beno, hartzen diren erabakiak mantentzen eta garatzen badira, izan ditzakegu.

Halere, abertzaletasuna EAEtik bertatik eta hona begira ulertzeko premia ez dugu berehalakoan izango. Honi gehitzen badiogu hemen abertzaletasuna soziologikoki eta erakundeetan nagusi izan dela orain arte, argi dago hemen beste parametro politikoetan jokatzen ari garela. Hau da, “zergatik da posible NaBai Nafarroan eta EAEn ez?” galdera planteatzen denean, lehenik eta behin, hori planteatzen duenak zer planteatzen du? EAJ, Batasuna, EA eta Aralar elkarrekin joatea? Hori al da?

Bigarrenik, zer esaten ari da, gaur egun baldintzak betetzen direla?

Hirugarrenik, positiboa dela hori? EAEn? Non eta abertzaletasuna nagusi den eremuan abertzaleon arteko ezker-eskuin dialektika albo batera utzi behar al dugu? Azkenik, abertzaletasuna EAEtik EAEra egin behar da, eta EAEren berezitasunei begira ere egin behar da, Nafarroan eta Iparraldean egiten den bezala.

Alegia, egoera bestelakoa da hemen. Hemen oinarri sendoa jarri behar da, eutsi egin behar zaio eta bere bidea egingo badugu –EAEn unionisten artean gertatzen den bezala– abertzaleon artean ere ezker-eskuin dialektika garatu beharko da.

NaBaik segituko al du EAk eta Aralarrek eman duten pausoa emanda?


Zergatik ez luke jarraitu beharko? EAk eta Aralarrek lehen pausoa eman dutelako?

Nafarroan Aralarren eta EAren agintekeria salatu dute sektore batzuek
.

Beno, sinatu duten akordioan baldintza ideologikoak eta estrategia batzuk daude. Horiek bere egiten dituztenek badute parte-hartzea. Nire konfiantza da, gutxienez, NaBai orain daudenekin osatuko dela.

Iparraldean berriz, EHBai plataforma azkeneko bozetan ez zen oso ondo atera. EAren jarrera zaila. EAJ kanpo. ABren eta Batasunaren artekoak ez zuen onena eman.

Hasteko eta behin botoa eskatu zuten, baina botoek ez zutela ondorio praktikorik ekarriko kontuan hartu behar zuten. Eta hori beti da akatsa. Nire ustez proposamenak modu positiboan egin behar dira eta herritarren ardurekin eta premiekin lotu egin behar dira. Eta horrek balio du Euskal Herri osorako. Ipar Euskal Herrian une sendoa bizi izan zen Batera plataformaren aldarrikapenen inguruan. Baina horrek ez zuen biderik burutu eta nekea sortu da. Dena den, azken hauteskundeak koiunturalak izan ziren eta aurrerantzean EHBaik lortuko du dagokion tokia.
PSE-EEren eta PPren arteko Ituna
PSEk eta PPk beteko al dute legealdia? Hori izan ezean, EAJrekin ituna lor lezake PSEk?

Zaila. Izan ere, Alderdi Sozialistak eta PPk EAEn –eta Nafarroan ere bai– sinaturik duten akordioa Espainiara begira egina dago, eta akordio hori arriskuan jartzen duenak –gehiengo unionista apurtzen duenak–botoetan ordaindu beharko du Espainian. Nori komeni zaio legealdia kolokan jartzea? Espainiako Kongresurako hauteskundeak egin arte behintzat ez PPri ez PSOEri. Noski, ondoren, EAEko hauteskundeak gerturatu ahala, euren arteko desadostasunak azalduko dituzte. Baina orain akordioa zalantzan jartzea... ez, inola ere, ez batak ez besteak.
EITB hizpide
Aldaketa nola islatu da EITBn?

Nik ez dut ikusten EITBn aldaketarik. Bestelako balorazioetan sartu gabe, guk kontratazio politikan hauxe salatzen dugu: langileen lan baldintzak eta lan egoerak bertsuak dira lehen eta orain. Duela bi astean eman zizkiguten –guk eskatuta– Gaztea Irratiaren kontratazioen berri. Oker ez banago, 1992z geroztik ez da lanpostu deialdirik egin Gaztean. Eta gure azken galderari “...ez daukagu lan postu berrien aurreikuspenik” erantzun ziguten. Hau da, orain arte kontratazio mota batekin jardun izan duten langileek kontratazio mota berarekin jarraitu beharko dute, behin-behineko kontratuz eta kolokan. Adibide bat baino ez da.

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