Based on the chosen theme for her doctoral thesis, Araolaza is giving a talk for the Basque Country in which she explains the historical place that women have had in Basque dance, with a very significant title: Women in Basque dance: the history of a lie. Last March 14, he was at the headquarters of the Gautxoriak association of Erandio and in this interview we gather the essence of what was said there.

"The story of a lie." What, at the bottom, is the lie?

A vision that has been in force throughout the 20th century… yes, a liar, why look for another word, according to which women have not danced by tradition. This has to be very nuanced, as when formulated it is precisely formulated towards the aurresku. When Father Donostia and others said that, they meant in the aurresku that women have not danced normally, but have been danced. It is a concept formulated at the beginning of the twentieth century and has followed its course to the present day, and is in force in different perspectives.

To whom? Does the majority of Basque citizenship add to that?

In the case of the Basques I do not know, but I would say yes in the imagination of many agents of the Basque dance. That doesn't mean that this is actually done in practice, but even today, when women dance in the aurresku, there's often a consciousness like this, as if it's something "allowed." "This was traditionally men's, but now, in the name of equality, or because there are no boys, or -- so do women." But not because it corresponds legally.

Contrary to this idea, in recent years an audiovisual document of around 1920 has acquired great relevance in which the women of Santurtzi dance the aurresku.

The curious thing is that, precisely at the time I denied, there are several testimonies that show that women danced the aurresku. In addition, this film is the oldest audiovisual document of an aurresku (the string, the ones without rope arrived much later), either male or female. Data from 1921-22.

He has also cited an example from Erandio, 1910: an aurresku championship for women.

Yes, at the end of the 19th century and the beginning of XX.aren the championships are beginning to multiply. They were very common, for example, the aurresku championships of the elderly. ‘For people over 65’, ‘over 69’… And there were women, and there were elderly women… It’s very interesting, it’s an imaginary that doesn’t exist today. If there are no imaginations of pre-artisan women, what to say about their championships. And grandmothers' championships!

How can lie break through if people looked at the opposite?

That is the essence of my thesis. It is closely related to the transformations that occurred in the gender perspective at that time. The late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries were very important times of change in the history of gender perspectives. It was a very complex process, and the result was that the binary system was expressed more clearly than ever before. We are different from the moment of birth, and that confirms our trajectory; we behave differently in society, with behaviors that complement each other, and that is true in all areas of life.

Of course, to dance too.

Yes. Dance has a great symbolic value. This binary view of the world can be confirmed through dance, which is both represented and nurtured by it, through very stereotyped roles. In this context, the denial of the times must be included, not intentional, but involuntary denial. They projected their gender perspective, very morally linked.

Christian morality, nothing to say…

That's right. One example is that of song collectors, especially those who were at the beginning of the 20th century, Father Donostia and... They said: ‘The Basques do not curse, because they are good believers’. The oaths were thrown into the singing, but through a automatism it was repeated: “If in this song there is a blasphemy, this is not Basque, it is a distortion that comes from outside, a contagion, or what has created the song is not a decent Basque.” Otherwise, his building was upset. They pretended they didn't see it, and they were visible, they couldn't hide, they couldn't.

"A prophecy that will fill itself," you said in your speech. The denial made it happen…

Yes. The most obvious change that will occur since the 19th century XX.enera is that until the 19th century bans will systematically prevail in the relationship between women and dance. The Church and, in many cases, civil power assumed this task as guardians of morality. The Church placed this burden on civil power and exercised it hand in hand. And then a much more effective strategy was taken: deny. Finally, by denial, the women stopped dancing. It's very curious. In the first three decades of the 20th century there are numerous testimonies that show women dancing the aurresku, but especially in the first two decades. The de Santurtzi, precisely, will be one of the last to reach the Biscayan capital.

Why?

Starting in the 1920s and the 1930s with tremendous force, this denial caused women to stop practicing this type of dance. In return, the binary view was completely digested, and in response to that, they denied the same paths they had offered for women to dance, but as women.

And what does this mean?

Men will be gudaris, ezek dantzaris, and women gorularis, or poxpolines, arc danzaris, ribbon dancers and apple dancers. There is a tremendous conceptual construction that led women to certain kinds of dances that at that time are considered feminine even though until then the boys danced them with total normality. But at that time a classification was made: male and female dances, and each gender was limited to repertoires, clothing, aesthetics… assigned to it. The prophecy was fulfilled then...

Has all this lasted until today?

With a lot of strength. It was very significant that, when we published Santurtzi's video, there were some comments on the network and that a dancer from a group very involved in the creation of the Basque dance said that "very well, women dressed as women and dancing". The most important thing for him was not that the women danced the aurresku (something he refused), but that they did it with the right dress. And that way of dancing attributed the gender mark. The Dantzari Dantza del Duranguesado can be a way to dance stereotyped as the Basque dance at the time: intense movements, kicks, raising the leg up, jumps, very vertical movements. The representation of the upper part of the trunk is void. This model has meant the transformation of other repertoires throughout the twentieth century to comply with this supposed stereotype of Basque dance. Gipuzkoa's dance is very paradigmatic. At the beginning of the 20th century, in Gipuzkoan dances, he barely raised his leg, and when he got up, he only rose to the height between his knee and his waistline. The way to dance was much quieter than the present one.

Is there a conflict in the area of Basque dances, something against that building...?

I think there is everything in attitudes, but things also need to be changed, because there is a big wave in society on this issue and we are inventing how to apply in the field of dance the criteria we use in other areas. The roles are played, and if you see a woman dancing hard, instead of saying, "How good," you say, "It looks like a boy." I therefore believe that there are such tensions, and some still do not know where to put them.

However, one of the big problems is that the kids of the Basque Country Dantza go very few, right?

Yes. In discrimination against women there are still some examples, but let us say that this is where the speed of the feet has been taken and guaranteed at the level of the right; what is not guaranteed at the moment is the possibility of dancing the boys. They are not guaranteed to be children because they receive stereotypes that condition their free choice. When someone says to me ‘we cannot force anyone to do anything, if the kids don’t want to dance is their choice’, I say it’s not a free choice. A 6-7-year-old boy has a clear awareness that choosing dance as a means of expression is a socially remunerated option in his community. It's no coincidence that all kids like to dance until they're 4 years old, and none of them are 6 years old. That's neither nature, nor biology, nor free choice.

This interview was posted by Hiruka and we brought it to ARGIA thanks to the CC-by-sa license.