Pp has won the elections in Spain with an absolute majority in Congress. However, since the last elections the number of votes in his favour has not increased so much, as Rajoy has said. Did you expect it? Or more?

Our aim was to secure the majority to govern Spain, and we have achieved the absolute majority. We have won 600,000 votes from the previous elections. The question has to be put in a different way, because the pp was in opposition with ten million votes in favour. I had 180 Members, and we got 186. The best result obtained so far by the center-right.

In view of the situation of the PSOE Government, it was not difficult to win that way.

Obviously, the bad policy of the Government, which is the acting President, Rodríguez Zapatero, is also reflected in the Executive. If Spain had the European Union (EU) average unemployment, unemployment would increase by 2.5 million people, which would change the situation. The PSOE did not take the necessary measures, when necessary. The parameters of the economic crisis have been so terrible that it has squandered public money: Plan E, including EU grants. At the last moment the accounts that were not in the State bulletin have appeared: The State has borrowed money and has had to borrow large loans. In addition, the Socialists have described us as an anti-patriot. With this government it is easier to win, OK, but we have been consistent with our proposals.

Governing in the next era is not going to be easy, because the economic crisis is even greater.

Yes. In addition, this government has opposed our proposals: to increase public spending, to raise taxes (including VAT). That plan, called E, amounted to EUR 18 billion, and, finally, in practice, this money has been disbursed. Soft economic measures have not brought wealth.

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The PSOE has drawn up 41 plans, one day it has raised it and the opposite tomorrow. On May 10, 2010, Zapatero surprised us when he presented the measures to deal with him at the Congress of Deputies. Then it radically changed its economic policy. “We will go into debt, but we will give the money to the municipalities and others...” he said. Finally, it was an additional expenditure. These changes led to a reduction in staff: Between 5 and 10%. In addition, it frozen salaries, including pensions, except the minimum ones. That's when he started to worry about public spending. Let us not forget that this government had a surplus in the state box at the beginning of the legislature. After two years, the deficit is brutal. The Spanish public debt is not higher than that of other European countries, the gravity has been the speed of change, the way of moving from positive to negative numbers: We have moved from the debt of EUR 300 billion to EUR 700 billion in a wink.

German Chancellor Angela Merkel immediately called Mariano Rajoy to remember that she is in an unbeatable position to govern, because she has an absolute majority, and to make reforms.

The call was expected and, as we know, positions on both sides have appeared in the conversation, as is normal. Merkel said: "Do not fall asleep, you have to delve into measures to make reforms reliable," he said. In other words, reducing the deficit and debt, and asking the EU for less money. Rajoy says: “That’s how it’s going to be, but I also ask you for a bit of maneuver, I’m not yet president.” Europe must give Spain a margin to do its homework. In other words, they give us time to take paper and pen or to get closer to the computer.

How will the government differ from pp to PSOE?

For example, how to cope with management. That with PSOE is what sets us apart to start with. In general, the left, like the socialists, tends to invade public spaces to increase public life and reduce private life. The Socialists have diminished the initiative of society and, as a result, have invested more money in the preparation of larger budgets and increased expenditure. These are the resources they have received from the citizens. On the contrary, in PP we believe more in the capacity of the person, in people who strive for private initiative and generate wealth. Solidarity policies must be put in place, but not excessive public expenditure; financial prominence must be given to civil society.

From economy to territorial issue. The political map has been taken by pp blue, except in Catalonia and the CAV, where it is present.

I have made a positive reading of the results of Catalonia, including those of Galicia. What happened to the Government of Núñez Feijo. Despite the anti-grass roots measures of these governments and the cutbacks that have been made, the Catalan and Galician citizens have understood that the situation was untenable. In the autonomous communities, credit, especially in Catalonia, was practically nil. Workers have had to make patriotic bonds with high interest in order to keep the gear of the autonomic administration in operation. CíU inherited the debt of the trio and the bipartite in Galicia. But they both did well. Learning is that society is an adult. Many times we do not value it, but when people are well informed about the situation, although some sectors are willing to protest, the majority of citizens express their desire with the vote. Although it sees the situation as serious, reforms and cutbacks must also be made, but governments support them. People know that we will not get out of this difficult situation easily. In the CAV, to begin with, the last unparalleled socialist feud has fallen. The Socialist Party has never had such a small representative in the democratic history of Spain.

I would, however, like the results of Amaiur and the PNV to be assessed.

It is clear that Amaiur [then met] had a great success in the municipal elections and has now repeated it. Therefore, we must have serenity and perspective when analysing data and electoral sociology. In Gipuzkoa, half of the seats have moved from PSOE to Amaiur. It is true that the latter did not participate in the previous ones, but EA and Aralar, although they were dispersed. Has it been the transfer of votes? The PNV has endured. He did not vote for Amaiur. It is, however, a new situation. But it is also true that Amaiur has taken advantage of the situation. ETA has announced a final ceasefire in the campaign, in which some of its members have called for their political participation. They say it was good to be in Amaiur, they were carriers of peace. They have made him propaganda. A collective illusion has emerged, and there it is. We will have to see if, over time, in places with government responsibilities, when the original ideological nuances appear, when the social project is built, the different ways of thinking in Amaiur and Bildu will remain united.

Mariano Rajoy has announced that he will not take Amaiur in the first round of contacts with the Basque parties.

It's normal. Some groups in Amaiur must, first of all, take a decisive step from an ethical and civic perspective. They must absolutely reject the violence and call for the dissolution of ETA. They have not yet come the way. Furthermore, they have to make a clear explanation of the political model – discussing this territoriality yes or no, self-determination yes or no –. That is, what they propose materially and practically: how they want to articulate this society. In that there are doubts: what and what is the attitude towards the other political forces of Basque society, what place we have in its scheme.

In any case, Amaiur represents the citizens of this State. Everything goes into the Constitution.

To make it clear, yesterday, a member of the Abertzale left said – Rufi or – that we do not refuse to receive in the future the votes of the PNV, the United Left or the Socialist Party, did not say the vote of the PP. Our attitudes and yours are very separate. I just want to normalize the world of the Abertzale left in the future, to assume democratic values in their depth. In fact, your project can be inclusive or imposing. Let's see if it's the first one. In our view, this has not yet come. At present, pp does not see the way to speak, not even for that minimal agreement.

How do you think that Mariano Rajoy should address the Aiete declaration, the process opened after the ETA decision?

ETA is not over. ETA has not claimed the surrender of the weapons, the dissolution of them, or the end of them. It is, of course, clear that the situation is not, for example, that of the year 2000. This process is new. We must apply great doses of meaning, with patience, we must follow the evolution of the facts carefully and, within the legality, be sensitive in terms of evolution. Rajoy is very capable of redirecting this situation and it is also capable of the Ministers of the Interior or of Justice that he is going to appoint for it. But a political process cannot take place today until the next day. Of course, I too would like to.

Interestingly, the four major political forces (PP, PNV, Amaiur, PSOE) began to compare votes after the elections. Iñaki Oyarzábal said that pp is the most voted party in all four countries, although not in pp.

This is inherent in political dialectics. To begin with, the constituencies are provincial, they do not exist in the CAV or in Navarre. Here or there, how it happens, it's a game that's made when the numbers come out better. These elections are national, and sometimes we ourselves forget that. They are elections to govern Spain.

He has mentioned the nation, and for many the nation is a Basque nation.

But constitutionally, it doesn't. This is the desired reality of some, but not real. And I think it's very difficult to change that. One can say that my reality is that of these four countries in Spain, or the seven, or I don't know what part of the province. You can discuss and deepen that approach, but today, the legal framework and the Constitution are what they are. It is true that in these elections something has happened that has not so far happened in the Basque Country [Basque Country]. We can make an interpretation of the community, as you have done, but that is a distortion of reality. In other words, in the rest of Spain basketball has been played, and here handball. There the issue has been the economic crisis, and here the confrontation between the PNV and Amaiur has become a fundamental issue. It has been played in the key of nationalist hegemony, it has not been in the dynamic of change of the Spanish Government. They have been the precedent of the Basque elections, located in the Basque nationalist sector, in which EA takes over the leadership. This has polarized the campaign. Without that, there would surely be fewer nationalist votes. For example, some voters have given priority to the PNV over the PSE, which does not look favourably on the PSOE policy. Some pp voters have been assured in Madrid that the pp government does so, and then they have voted for the PNV so that Amaiur does not win the hegemony in the CAV.

“The most important thing is to keep talking and not die,” he told us in the interview we did in the year 2000, on these pages. How do you see the new President Mariano Rajoy – to address the issue of peace and normalisation – in the face of this new time?

Mr Mariano Rajoy is going to manage the new time with common sense and patience. The issue and the concern about terrorism have come down to the Spaniards, who are now far from the concern of the past. According to the CIS surveys, we are more concerned with the Basques than with the rest of the Spaniards. It must be borne in mind, it is not the same situation. Mariano Rajoy has said that, if there is a will in the world of terrorism, he will address the issue with a line of legality. It's a new time, but it takes time to address the issue. Of course, I would prefer it to be sorted out tomorrow.

Do you think Mariano Rajoy is the most difficult party to channel the process?

Not especially. In the pp there are those who defend the rights of the victims of terrorism, it is true, but as in the rest of the parties, in society in general. And victims need knowledge.

Does the escort continue?

Yes. And also other party mates, even if they don't want to take it. In fact, Pello Urizar has warned that there may be a rupture in the world of ETA, a radicalization of it. In other words, if things are not channelled to overcome the conflict – as was intuited, ETA has called in the last dialogue to negotiate the French and Spanish governments – they could be actions. We all know what we are talking about here, so I say that in order to start the ETA process it has to hand over the weapons. ETA has taken a step, but we have not reached the end of ETA. The experience of previous years requires prudence and patience.