The 2011 municipal and provincial elections could be the first milestone for the gathering of leftist forces. The interlocutors believe that it is time to clarify the unknowns: “It’s a question of defining well what the forces of the left are for, it’s not a question of strategy, it’s a question of tactics. The intention is not to collect more acronyms, but to unite them in a natural way.” We started the conversation with these assumptions. In any case, above and beyond the need to work in the institutions of the people, both are primarily responsible for the nature and evolution of the left.

Let’s talk about the nature and situation of both the Alternative and the Standing parties.

Pictures of Ander Rodriguez: The nature of the alternative has sometimes been misunderstood. The alternative is not simply a division of the EU, because those of us who were members of the EU are a minority. The diagnosis of our situation is this: the economy has revealed to us the crisis of capitalism, as well as that of the left, which is unable to create the means necessary to transform the situation. It was because of this deficiency that the process of Constructing the Alternative began to materialize, which has become the Alternative. Our idea is not to have the Alternative as an end in itself, but as a means. The alternative is a means of rethinking the radical left in the Basque Country in the sovereignty and social transformation key.

Pictures of Ander Santiago: We, the majority of the militants, have come from the transitional period. However, the social movements have lost their strength. She has grown old and needs to be renewed. Standing has not only been nourished by the LKI-EMK in which it was founded, it has not been of a single discourse, it has had the contribution of many ideologies. The national problem has given us the most control, after the defeat of Lizarra-Garazi this problem intensified among us. Our being is conditioned by the evolution of the whole Left. In recent years, new projects of Aralar, Alternative, Anti-Capitalist Party have appeared. It seems that it is a time of disorganization of the left, but it is not quite so, the left is having to clear its way. Especially in the Basque Country, the forces are reorganizing to offer something new.

Make a diagnosis of the crisis of the left.

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: We are very Euro-centrist in dealing with the crisis of the left. We usually talk about Europe and the European model. This trend is a kind of political neo-colonialism. In other words, here is the crisis of the left, but not in Latin America: In Bolivia, Ecuador and Venezuela the left is not in crisis, on the contrary, social movements are strong and are carrying out social changes that were unthinkable. It is simply acting on the European left.

I'm talking about A. More places to stay in Rodriguez: It's a good specification. When we talk about the left-wing crisis, we are talking about the left-wing model that has collapsed in Europe. The left has not been able to create a solid alternative to the system, but in many cases it has been content to have a formal opposition to power, and the formal opposition also consolidates power. The left has moved away from social movements. It is now reacting to the construction of useful media and institutions. In fact, the institutions should not be the ends of the left, we should understand the institutions as the means to transform society. There are serious attempts to build a radical left in France (NPA), Germany (Die Linke), Portugal (Bloco) or Greece. In the 21st century, there are political and social capitals in Europe that can create a new left-wing force. The left must feed on social movements, but not for Manichaean uses. In our country, for the word, when an agreement has been made between social movements, it has tended to instrumentalize it. We do not want the new left to be the transmission belt of movements, but to be the means by which they come together. The struggle of the social movement is to overcome the model of the current system, and to overcome the capitalist model we see the need to unite all types and areas of struggle –feminism and/or ecology–.

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: All right, all right. It is also necessary to distinguish between Eastern and Western Europe. The model of the former Communist Party of Europe has been fractured. Capitalism, on the other hand, has left very little room for reform, much less after this crisis. The banner of social democracy is the welfare state, the reform of capitalism that seems to have a more human face. However, when capitalism saw the collapse of the system, space was reduced. As a result, the Social Democracy has nothing left to reform. Let’s talk openly: without social democracy, neoliberalism would be impossible. For example, since the fall of the Berlin Wall, social democratic and Labour parties in Europe have brought about restrictions on social rights. The big trade union domes have made a bed for neo-liberalism.

You're the Arrasateans. What do you want to bring to the realization of the Basque left?

I'm talking about A. More places to stay in Rodriguez: In Mondragón, for example, we worked on a process of synergy, we did not propose a common electoral initiative. Over the past four years we have been doing street work, common tasks of mobilization and struggle. We created alternatives to the government’s policies. We do not consider electoral processes to be strategic, but rather tactical. Elections are a constraint, among other constraints. Institutional work serves as a loudspeaker, but social transformation cannot take place through institutions. We try to develop the initiative in two ways: if we have representation in the institutions we work on their strict limits, but at the same time we bet on changing the model of these institutions.

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: Our work in the institutions is very limited, but we have defended the fact that the treaties are natural, that the pacts are carried out by the lower militants. We are not in favour of accumulating the acronym because the party leadership advises this. If there is no action programme in the municipality, nothing new will emerge. In addition, often the result is the opposite of what we want to achieve. We are very pleased with the work we have done with the members of the Alternative. In fact, not only in Mondragón, Antzuola, Oñati and Bergara –even without a councilor here– we are doing a lot of good work. We hope to maintain the coalition in the future and act with other people on the left.

Does the crisis of the left in the Basque Country have any notable peculiarities?

I'm talking about A. More places to stay in Rodriguez: The crisis of the left in the Basque Country is given in parameters similar to those that we have mentioned, but at the same time there is the national variable, the distorting element in the right/left bitality. The left that must be built in the Basque Country must be clear about how it wants to address the issue of the nation. The left/right axis should be well studied, while at the same time addressing the issue of the nation appropriately. In this sense, ETA has become a distorting agent, ETA and/or a favorable attitude towards armed struggle. The clear position to be adopted with regard to the armed struggle of ETA will raise a kind of steel fence and help to strengthen the process of convergence of the left.

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: ETA is a hindrance to the configuration of the new left. If ETA were to lay down its arms, all of us – the Nationalist Left and the Radical Left – would win. This would help pave the way for the left-wing civil movement. Well grounded in civil disobedience, if social struggles are well promoted, the Basque left could emerge strengthened.

How do you live the process that is taking place in the Patriotic Left?

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: We are avid, we do not know how it will end, but all the processes that are undertaken to overcome the conflict are very positive. The nationalist left has made a bold bet, but we don’t know in which position ETA is. In any case, there has been an obvious change within the Nationalist Left. Without “paying attention” to the anti-terrorist policy that the state can develop, it is betting on change. I hope that the civil movement will emerge victorious and find itself on the path with Alternative and Defeat in these parameters. We hope to have a place in the debate that will take place in the evolution of the Basque left.

I'm talking about A. More places to stay in Rodriguez: I agree with Ander. The ideal is now to “not get involved” in the process of the patriotic left. The process will influence the parameters of the conflict in the Basque Country, and clearly the space of the left will be redefined. In this redefinition, Zutik and the Alternative have a lot to say. A new strong left needs a new political culture, we need to reject the political cultures of the past. The avant-garde that has been very involved in the left of the Basque Country must be left behind, as well as various types of exclusions.

What can the internationalist left historically bring?

I'm talking about A. About Santiago: There are anti-liberal parties that see the way capitalism is reformed, to the advantage of the old social democracy. There is a dominant discourse that is spreading around the revolutionary project. When I hear that, I feel like I’m going back. Another sector says: capitalism cannot be reformed, it must be destroyed.

Due to the altermundist movement, a slogan was introduced on the left to the very bottom: “Another world is possible.” For me it’s a simple slogan, even a coward. I mean, the time has come to tell us what other world we want. It is up to the left to clarify this, its duty is to build alternatives to capitalism, only to say “not another world is possible”.

I'm talking about A. More places to stay in Rodriguez: Let's not make it a productive socialism. We want the left to think about how to combine the new social and economic model with the ecological tradition. The left must cultivate a redefinition of eco-socialism. One of the mistakes of the left in the Basque Country has been to filter the international relationship of the left under the sieve of the nation. I have had contacts with organizations that experience national conflict and it is good to work in the area, but we have to look for referents and expand networks around the world. The struggle of the left cannot be confined to the framework of the Basque Country, it is a global struggle, we must move from local to global in collaboration with other forces of the left.